Since we have a lot of racist redditors coming over here catching bans for their historical ignorance about the June 4th incident, here are some resources:
- Notes for the 30th anniversary of the Tiannment incident.
- It wasn’t a massacre of peaceful students, but a skirmish between PLA soldiers and armed detachments from the pro-capitalist / free market reform movement. The protest movement, as evidenced by their own accounts, called for market liberalisation, and free market reforms, rallying around a replica of the statue of liberty. After the movement had been building in the square for seven weeks, unarmed soldiers were sent in to disperse the protesters, after which many soldiers were beaten to death, torched, and lynched. The New York Times death count went from 2600, to many thousands, to 8000, to tens of thousands. In reality only around ~200 (including soldiers) were killed or trampled, in smaller clashes outside the square. The on-scene New York Times reporter disavowed the article, especially about machine-gunning of protesters. A wikileaks cable from a US ambassador to the US state department, confirmed that no killings or machine-gunnings took place in the square.
- Latin American diplomat eyewitness account of June 3-4 events on Tiananmen Square wikileaks (PDF)
- There was a Spanish television crew that covered the entire Tiananmen Square incident as it unfolded. Their footage showed that there was no massacre. A few things worthy of pointing out - Liu Xiaobo and Hou Dejian, both student leaders of the Tiananmen protests, have been recorded as saying that they never saw anyone killed at the protests.
- The protest movement followed the line of “color revolutions”, in which the US tried to destabilize and create counter-revolutions in eastern Europe and Latin America after the fall of the USSR. The strategy was to stir division within and without, by inundating the media with news of massacres of “peaceful”, pro-capitalist / market reformers.
- The defeat of a counter revolution in China.
- Interviews from some of the student leaders.
- An account from a resident.
- Tiananmen Square “Massacre”, A Propaganda Hoax.
- The truth about the Tiananmen square protests
Westerners aren’t helpless innocents whose minds are injected with atrocity propaganda, science fiction-style; they’re generally smug bourgeois proletarians who intelligently seek out as much racist propaganda as they can get their hands on. This is because it fundamentally makes them feel better about who they are and how they live. The psychic and material costs are rationally worth the benefits. -Roderic Day
All the libs in the comments really living up to the quote.
Lemmitors really didn’t sent their best to this thread.
The Amerikkkan randomly calling me racist while being racist was fun if entirely unproductive. Same with the Canadian settler.
Don’t feel that you need to argue with these racists, because it can lead to burn-out quickly. You can always report them and we’ll try to get to it ASAP.
Also thank you for your hard work in educating everyone. It’s not going to waste, and everyone is learning a lot from your posts. o7
Also thank you for your hard work in educating everyone. It’s not going to waste, and everyone is learning a lot from your posts. o7
Thank you always great to hear.
Don’t feel that you need to argue with these racists, because it can lead to burn-out quickly. You can always report them and we’ll try to get to it ASAP.
Yeah definitely I always make sure to report any actual racism etc I see but it is fun to blow off steam arguing with/making fun of them at the same time even if it’s entirely unproductive.
Speaking from experience. Still be careful. Even when you think you are blowing off steam, more could be going on then you think. I didnt realize how miserable I had gotten till I had take some time away.
Arguing with randos on the internet can honestly really fuck with a person.
Seconding this, @QinShiHuangsShlong@lemmy.ml’s comments have been fantastic lately, and absolutely aren’t going to waste.
Thank you very glad to hear
If it helps, it was fun to see you owning them
The operative word being smug
Alexa, what is the definition of “irony”?
This is just smug for “no you”
I just finished reading this article today a few hours ago! it felt like such an eerily perfect dissection of liberals it is incredible impressive, it doesn’t reduce their annoyance but it does provide an easier way to deal with it
Link?
My bad for not linking above, here it is: https://redsails.org/masses-elites-and-rebels
Thanks I’m looking forward to reading later
No problem!
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Americans think they know about Tienanmen Square 1989 while themselves living in a police state / surveillance state.
No one talks about the Philadelphia police bombing (yes, a literal bombing) of a Black residential neighborhood in 1985.
No one talks about the police brutality against peaceful anti-Vietnam war groups in the 1960s/70s. Veterans who were drafted to fight an immoral war of aggression overseas were then beaten by the police for protesting that war. In 1970, the Ohio national guard opened fire on college students protesting at Kent State.
Eric Garner, Tamir Rice (12 years old), Daniel Shaver, Philando Castile, Breonna Taylor, George Floyd, Renee Good, Alex Pretti and far, far too many people have been murdered on camera. Millions around the world protested the routine extrajudicial killings of unarmed Americans. But police killings increased every year during the Biden administration and Trump continues to throw people in the back of unmarked vans.
Americans judge the PRC (and every socialist country) by their own retelling of its worst blunder in history; Americans judge the US by it’s latest controversy while forgetting everything else.
I’ve not seen one mention of Tlatelolco massacre which was propped up by the CIA through the mexican goverment.
I love whenever someone posts the “tank man” photo because the liberals always reveal themselves like roaches scattering across the room when a lightswitch is turned on. Mod ban hammer squish them all plz and thank you.
I love your portfolio.
aww, you’re sweet, thank you.
You are so very welcome. Thank you for sharing it with us!
Look up the Bonus Army
What is the bottom photo?
The lady who got shot in Minneapolis.
Renée Good was her name
Ok.
Why is this in c/memes?
Because the libs in here are walking memes
Here on .ml we can enjoy content past cat videos.
No way…. This is a bridge too far for me
Because repetition is an effective way of convincing people to accept a narrative, and meme channels tend to be more widely subbed than others.
The funniest part is, repetition was the exact method used by the US and aligned countries to convince everyone that there was a massacre lmfao
Goebbels’ ghost should be embarrassed he couldn’t pull it off nearly as well.
He was seriously just an amateur compared to US propaganda apparatus, there’s even clear proof how he believed US really do protect it’s citizens, when U-boot sunk SS Athenia 3 september 1939 on which 28 US citizens died, Hitler, Goebbels, Donitz, Raeder immediately panicked that US will use that as casus belli like with Lusitania and they censored and propagandised entire case so much that the fact it was U-boot that sunk the ship was only accidentally revealed at Nuremburg trials.
This is interesting. I wanted to learn more about the propagandizing of it. Do you know of reliable English sites to do that?
Iirc i first read about it in book about WW2 on sea by Janusz Piekałkiewicz and also seen it in some British TV, and it’s on wiki too, so even western libs admit that happened, though they will never go to the conclusion how that compare US and 3rd Reich propaganda apparatus.
Thanks, I saw the Wikipedia entry but didn’t read the whole thing because Wikipedia. I’ll do that, later.
Do you… think that there were no protestor deaths at tiananmen square?
There were both protestor deaths as well as PLA personnel deaths (which outnumbered protestor death, actually). But even the US diplomat who was present through the whole event said that there were riots and riot control, but not a massacre.
It’s only almost 40 years later that the continuous lying about history has twisted people’s perception of what actually happened.
Even American newspapers didn’t call it a massacre until much later lmao. Probably because the evidence of many of the protestors meeting with American officials before the riots was readily available.
Thankfully, such protests/colour revolutions are impossible now in China, so no regime change can be carried out by the US
Pla deaths outnumbered protestor deaths? Jeez, what’re you smoking? Even the Chinese govt didn’t claim that. And why are you thankful that ‘protests are impossible now’? Do you truly relish the political disenfranchisement of the populace so much? Smh my head
Do you truly relish the political disenfranchisement of the populace so much?
If you truly believe we are disenfranchised because the American backed regime change failed I truly feel sorry for you. China has one of the most involved political systems I have heard of. We have constant interaction with our elected representatives at the town/city and county level through the local party offices where feedback criticism and petitions for changes are constant. We are listened to and our ideas are constantly worked on and applied in different ways as satisfying the people and earning achievements is how you get your peers to elect you to the provincial and national level. There is a reason that even from Harvard’s studies they found we have a high satisfaction with our government (95+%).
protests are impossible now
This is also a falsehood we have protests but they are about real single issues as opposed to regime change events backed by outside agitators.
Can’t tell you how much your sympathy means to me, comrade
The working classes are in power in the PRC, not the opposite. They also have sovereignty over their internet and media, rather than letting western countries foment regime change.
It’s cool how you deny the agency and personhood of the protestors by outright stating that they were all plants by ‘western countries’. Very enlightened!
Yawn, try harder.
No, I relish watching imperialist ambitions crumble lol. I hope it happens in every country where the Western powers attempt a colour revolution. And I hope that people that collaborate with imperialist powers get executed for treason.
Idk whether you’re ignorant or malicious, but materialism will always win :)
Imperialism is bound to implode. You can hate the CPC and wish for the people’s revolution to fail, but in the end, it’ll always win, because they’ve understood materialism. Conversely, it’s inevitable that Western countries will implode and collapse because they can’t survive without the exploitation of us third worlders.
Count your days buddy boy. When our time comes, we will make no apologies for the terror
Outstanding to me that my only actual claim – that civilian humans were in fact killed during the infamous protests – is one that you folks actually do accept, albeit reluctantly, but y’all still got your knickers in a twist and are ascribing all sorts of stereotypes to me in your head.
There were no deaths on the square, only around Beijing. The western atrocity porn of the PLA running over unarmed students on the square is entirely fake.
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Do you support the Jan 6 insurgency, yes or no?
Only a few hundred people died, not thousands. And some people may have been armed! So it’s fine to kill scores of people.
“Some people” aka insurrectionists were not maybe armed.
These insurrectionists bombed and killed soldiers. And THEY. BOMBED. FIRST.
There is no maybe in this scenario just as much as there is no maybe in the Jan 6th insurrection.
What were these other soldiers supposed to do that are trained to fight and protect their country?
Just stand there and take some more?
What is the proper response according to you when a group of terrorists bombs a military convoy?The tanks were driving away and didn’t kill anyone this time
They didn’t kill him because he posed no threat unlike the terrorists that bombed their convoy.
End of story.What were these other soldiers supposed to do that are trained to fight and protect their country? Just stand there and take some more? What is the proper response according to you when a group of terrorists bombs a military convoy?
You edited your post so I’ll reply again: The test, which America and China both repeatedly fail, is having professional law enforcement and soldiers kill their own citizens. This is one of the most utter, final failures of government. There are plenty of options besides killing people, and when you take up arms and swear oaths to protect your country, and then kill citizens of your own country, you break your oath.
Your argument fails because there’s no need to actually intercede and halt protests. In the case of the pro-democracy movement crushed by the PLA in June 1989, martial law and attacks on protesters had begun en masse 2 weeks before the massacre. There was a steady escalation of violence leading up to the riots in early june. So the idea that the protestors “struck first” (even if that is a justification, which it isn’t, is false. The facts, which aren’t in dispute, were that the anti-corruption policies implemented to answer the complaints of the protestors were well-received, and further reforms were desired by everyone, not just the student protestors. Everyone except the local officials who were at risk of losing their positions by a government overhaul from authoritarianism to democracy.
The protest could have continued to be disrupted the way they already were before the massacre:
- Through wiretaps and arrests
- Through planted dissenters sowing chaos in the student’s ranks
- Through rubber bullets + tear gas, and other nonlethal methods
Instead, even though 300,000 people were protesting that period, the actions of an interim commander who acted on poor discipline and leadership, directly lead to at least hundreds, and possibly thousands, of his own people, in a small section of the city. That is a spectacular failure, and the end of a certain degree of human autonomy in China.
This is coming from someone who actually thinks China is leading the world in many ways. I do genuinely believe that China is actually less corrupt than many other nations, and the high degree of social cohesion in-country is something that gives them strength. Like I said in my first post: lots to admire, but this ain’t it.
This is just the other bullet points again! I’m sure if more armed rebels entered the capital it would have been incredibly messy and people would have died. And killing a ton of people, regardless of why, is a failure of government. Conflating one violent protest with another and then saying “America Bad so China Fine” is inane.
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tbf no one knows whatever happened to Tank Man it’s heavily censored
To the point where no one, not even the chinese government knows who he is
