At what point is someone responsible for what happens to them when they refuse to respect boundaries? (this could apply to parents, siblings, family, friends, exes, etc.).
If someone tells you—clearly and repeatedly—to leave them alone, that they don’t want you in their life, to stop showing up, stop contacting them, etc., and you ignore all of that… what do you expect is going to happen?
If you keep pushing, showing up uninvited, refusing to take “no” for an answer, and basically forcing your way into someone’s life (when they make it clear they don’t like you and don’t want you in their life multiple tomes and are Minding their own business not bothering you), and they eventually snap and start verbally going off on you—are they 100% in the wrong?
Yeah, being verbally abusive isn’t great. But at a certain point, you chose to keep putting yourself in that situation. You ignored every boundary that was set.
So do you actually “deserve” sympathy at that point? Or do you share responsibility for pushing things to that level?
Not only that, but why are you trying so hard to be in someone’s life that clearly doesn’t want you in it? It’s so annoying and pathetic, and it just loses sympathy points for me.
Not only that, but why are you trying so hard to be in someone’s life that clearly doesn’t want you in it? It’s so annoying and pathetic, and it just loses sympathy points for me.
It’s like people of color or LGBTQ+ individuals who are super MAGA conservative and “sell their own causes out.” They go to MAGA rallies and conservative spaces and then get a shocked Pikachu face when the people there treat them like shit. WHY ARE YOU THERE???
So like.
What the first person is doing is called “harassment”, as well as “stalking”. If you’re being harassed and/or stalked… look for legal help (For example, in the US, you can get the courts to issue a protective order, which, when or if they continue to violate the order can lead to consequences like jail time.)
Someone who continues pushing like this is not safe to be around. at all. You may wish to get a consult from a lawyer before going to the cops, they can go over options.
In any case; no verbally abusing a person who is stalking and harassing you like this is not inappropriate. Sometimes, the abuse is deserved. especially when this is a slowly ramping escalation.
You have to set aside domestic violence and child abuse, as there are economic and societal pressures and dynamics associated with those.
The moment one becomes aware that they are enabler of the abuse they are responsible for being abused.
I remember very clearly the day I realized I was allowing my toxic family to treat me like shit. It dawned on me that I was allowing them to do that.
I think this is a great ethical question!
Do you think the fable of the boy who cried wolf is in the same ballpark of conundrum?
In the sense that the kid overtly chooses to do the morally wrong thing -a thing that is universally socially damaging and stressful for the group - and eventually sympathy runs out and they leave him to be harmed?
I think there’s a lot of cool questions to be discussed in what you said.
What does it mean to deserve something?
What does it mean to be the person who gives someone something negative they ‘deserve’?
And my personal question would be - are there any bystanders in this situation and what’s their moral duty?
My gut instinct is a big tough guy “yeah fuck 'em”.
That of course elicits specific situations for me, like maybe the person is very high functioning autistic so they appear to be good at communicating but they’re not and can’t be held responsible for their actions in the same way as a neuro typical person…
I’d like to answer this question for situations where we’re just talking about people who are broadly speaking capable of being responsible and accountable for what they say.
Eh, not really, because that would mean that besides their external circumstances they also have to deal with some psychological and/or intellectual hang-ups… but the anger/annoyance from frustration is more than understandable. Human beings are complex and all of that. 🤷
At what point is someone responsible for what happens to them when they refuse to respect boundaries?
The moment they ignore the boundary.
are they 100% in the wrong?
The person being told to fuck off is in the wrong if they keep pushing. There is no grey area.
We know you don’t have a great track record for sympathy Grim but some people end up in bad situations through no fault of their own.
